BB FANS

UK Big Brother Forums






Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 1392 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 ... 93  Next
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 10 Sep 07, 18:12 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 04 Jun 02, 19:40
Posts: 29944
Location: Middle England
WE'RE NOT RUNNING AWAY

MADELEINE McCann’s parents fled Portugal as VIPs yesterday – only hours after being accused of killing her. Gerry and Kate McCann had vowed they would stay and fight to clear their names after they were branded official suspects.

But they flew out of Portugal’s Faro airport yesterday morning insisting they were not running away.

DailyStar


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 10 Sep 07, 19:57 
Offline
Big Brother
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 07 Nov 01, 2:00
Posts: 10186
One of the theories put forward by someone commenting on one of these news stories, is that the Portuguese police have made the McCanns suspects, to put the real culprit off their guard. The police have then let them leave the country which is not usual (maybe in an effort to stop them talking to the media, so that they can be left alone to look for the real culprit).

That's an interesting theory.


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 10 Sep 07, 20:29 
Offline
Big Brother
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 07 Nov 01, 2:00
Posts: 10186
Quote:
David Brown looks at the puzzles and mysteries at the heart of the four month investigation

What happened in the four hours before Madeleine was reported missing?

Kate and Gerry McCann claim that while they dined at a restaurant with friends regular checks were made on Madeleine and their two-year-old twins, Sean and Amelie, at their nearby holiday apartment. Mr McCann told police he saw his daughter asleep at about 9pm. A friend, Matthew Oldfield, entered the apartment at about 9.30pm but did not look in the bedroom Madeleine and the twins were sharing.

It is not known if anyone apart from Mr and Mrs McCann saw Madeleine alive between 6pm and 10pm, when she was reported missing by her mother. The timing is crucial but would be only circumstantial evidence in any prosecution. Although a small child could be killed quickly it would take time to hide a body so that it was not discovered in the biggest search in Portuguese history.

Why did Kate McCann cry out “They’ve taken her?” when she discovered Madeleine missing?

Portuguese police are reported to find it suspicious that Mrs McCann immediately believed that more than one person had taken her daughter. This could suggest that she knew who had taken Madeleine, perhaps people who thought they were helping Mrs McCann by removing her daughter’s body.

Alternatively, it could be an off-the-cuff remark by an hysterical mother or perhaps was misheard or misunderstood in the confusion of the night.

What were the movements of the McCann’s friends on the night Madeleine disappeared?

The McCann family had stayed at the Ocean Club resort with three other British couples and their five children, and a single woman. Russell O’Brien, a doctor from Exeter, left the restaurant for half an hour to look after his own daughter, returning shortly before Madeleine was reported missing.

His wife, Jane Tanner, was the only witness to report a man carrying away child from the McCann’s apartments. There is confusion about when members of the party arrived at the tapas restaurant and left to check on their own sleeping children.

How much alcohol did the McCanns and their friends drink on the evening Madeleine disappeared?

Kate and Gerry McCann and their friends are reported to have told detectives they shared four bottles of wine, with another two barely touched before Madeleine was discovered missing.

However, it is claimed detectives have recovered a bill showing they downed eight bottles of red wine and six white during the afternoon and evening.

Why was Madeleine’s bedroom window and shutter open?

Kate and Gerry McCann told police that the window shutter in Madeleine’s bedroom, which could not been seen from the restaurant, had been forced open.

Police tests showed the heavy metal shutter had not been forced up from the outside, so must have been pulled open from inside the room. Assuming that the abductor entered through the apartment’s unlocked patio windows, why would he or she not leave by the same way or the use the front door?

Or was the window opened to make it appear as if an intruder had used it to enter the bedroom?

Why did Madeleine’s sister and brother sleep through her “abduction”?

Sean and Amelie were heavy sleepers who were not disturbed by their sister’s abduction, claim their parents. However, they also slept through their mother’s hysterical response to Madeleine’s disappearance and the presence of dozens of people who joined the search before being carried out by a female police officer. Kate and Gerry McCann have strenuously denied sedating their daughter.

Why were the McCanns allowed to leave Portugal if they are suspects?

The Portuguese authorities allowed the McCanns to return to the UK after they agreed to reside only at their home in Rothley and to return for further questioning if necessary.

Portugese law states that after someone is declared a suspect, police have eight months to conclude the investigation into that individual. If they require further time officers can apply to the courts for a four-month extension.

If the McCanns refused to comply with a request to return to the Algarve for interview, Portuguese police could issue a European Arrest Warrant under which extradition can be carried out within six weeks.

Why has it taken so long to find the evidence that could implicate Kate and Gerry McCann?

The material was only collected at the end of July and early August in a review of the investigation carried out by Portuguese detectives with the help of British police and two sniffer dogs. Many of the samples are very small, containing just a few cells, while others are of poor quality because of damage by cleaning or simply the passing of time.

A full report of the findings will not be ready for weeks, but many results have already been passed to the Portuguese authorities.

What evidence were police looking for?

Detectives are searching for any evidence that proves Madeleine is dead or contradicts the accounts of Mr and Mrs McCann and other witnesses.

It appears the Forensic Science Service believes it has discovered compelling new evidence, possibly from more than one source. Portuguese detectives told Mrs McCann repeatedly that they found traces of Madeleine’s blood in a Renault Scenic hired three weeks after she disappeared, suggesting that the missing girl’s parents used the vehicle to carry her body. It is possible to tell if the blood came from a living person or from a corpse, and even the time of death. However, some reports suggest that the quality of the blood sample was too poor to confirm the origin while others have denied any blood was found in the vehicle and claim it was other “bodily fluids”. Unless a body had been placed in a freezer, it would have badly decomposed during the warm weather; leaving a mass of traces invisible to the human eye.

Does any trace of Madeleine in the hire car prove she was killed?

No. Mr and Mrs McCann hired the car to buy new clothes in the town of Portimão a day before they flew to Rome to see Pope Benedict XVI. They then used it regularly for family outings and to collect friends and relatives from Faro airport. They continued using the car until shortly before flying home yesterday. Kate and Gerry and their two-year-old twins would have often carried in the car items used by Madeleine. These items could easily certainly carry Madeleine’s hair and minute traces of skin, dried blood, saliva and vomit. The same could be said of the holiday apartments used by the McCanns and their friends in the Ocean Club resort. However, if the blood came from Madeleine’s corpse the only other highly unlikely explanation would be that a previous hirer had moved the body.

One report suggested yesterday that Madeleine’s DNA had been found on the floor of the McCanns holiday apartment, but because of degredation it was based on an incomplete picture, with only 15 of the 20 genetic markers usually used for such analysis.

What about the discoveries of the “cadaver” sniffer dog?

Mr and Mrs McCann were shown a police video of a sniffer dog used to find corpses “going crazy” when it approached the hire car. Reports also claim that is discovered the scent on the vehicle’s key fob. Mrs McCann is reported to have explained that in her work as locum GP she came into contact with six corpses in the weeks leading up to Algarve holiday.

This seems a high number for a locum GP working just a couple of days a week but would be easy to check against surgery records.

The crucial difficulty with the sniffer dog “evidence” is that it cannot distinguish between corpses. This type of dog is trained to find bodies, not identify where dead bodies have been. Crucially, they can become excited by other scents.

Any evidence of Madeleine’s death on Cuddle Cat?

The cadaver dog is alleged to have become excited when shown Madeleine’s favourite soft pink toy, called Cuddle Cat. The cat had become poignant symbol of a mother’s loss as Kate McCann carried it with her at all time from the night of Madeleine’s disappearance.

She washed it four days after the police tests, claiming it had become dirty. The toy was potentially crucial evidence and should have been seized by police very early in the investigation.

What evidence can be found in Mrs McCann’s Bible?

Mrs McCann, a devout Roman Catholic, claims that police told her that a crumpled page in her Bible was evidence that she was involved in the death of her daughter. The page contained a passage from Samuel II, chapter 12, verses 15-19, which recalls how man’s child is stricken with illness after he “scorns” the Lord.

The man fasts for seven days, refusing to get up off the ground, to try to gain redemption — but eventually his child dies. Mrs McCann claims that detectives told her that damage to the page proved she had been reading it.

Why are the McCanns suspects in their daughter’s killing?

Portuguese police refuse to say why the couple have been made official suspects. Under Portuguese law police can not question someone as if they had committed a crime unless they are a “suspect”. It could simply be that police wanted to ask the couple about the evidence they had collected, and that the seriousness of the process has been misunderstood and exaggerated by cultural and language differences. The McCanns believed that they were about to be charged with Madeleine’s death, but it does not appear police disclosed any crucial evidence to them.

All parties have strenuously denied any wrongdoing.


Madeleine McCann: the key questions


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 10 Sep 07, 22:03 
Offline
Dancing Queen
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 22 Jun 02, 21:01
Posts: 11505
Location: Back at the wacky races
Who the hell is David Brown?

A couple of things strike me about this, firstly have the Police actually confirmed that the DNA samples are Madeline's blood? Or are they just DNA? DNA could have come from toys, clothes anything which she had been in contact with.

Secondly I have been on 3 MarK Warner holiday's. They all run on the same principle. All food and wine is included. There is no bloody bill, so why is this guy talking about the number of bottles of wine on the bill. It's an all inclusive holiday and all you are asked to sign at the end of your meal, is a chit of paper, saying you had dinner, which contains your room number and the number of people eating and if you had any drinks such as cocktails which are not included in the holiday price. There is nothing which shows how many bottles of wine you have had, unless they keep secret tabs on the customers.

Thirdly, I have 3 children, at this age, two of them would have slept through a raucous party going on in the same room as them, no need for sedation, once they were asleep that was them, zonked til the morning.

This doesn't sound like evidence to me, it sounds like someone making up their own mind. I mean who is this guy anyway? Has he checked his facts?Has any of his musings come from proven Police facts or is it just the ramblings of a hack. These people are being tried by the press, which is a disgrace. I would like to see a ban on all reporting of this case, until the Police have completed a full investigation.

_________________
Give me the gratuitous sax and the senseless violins.


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 10 Sep 07, 23:41 
Offline
bookworm
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 28 Feb 04, 17:57
Posts: 19830
agreed ellie. I cannot imagine what it must be like to be falsly accused especially when trying to deal with the unsolved loss of their daughter. She still has to mother two other children the whole situation seems to be a total shambles with public opinion swinging this way and that. There is talk of the 'unlikely' event of the killer hiring the car to move the body but othe sinarios they have put forward could be just as unlikely. The not knowing must be absolute torture for the parents but add to that false accusation and it's amazing they are coping so well..

As for the bible bit. This really angers me. My daughter commented that ''people are saying'' the mother did it because of her faith etc and I told her she wasn't to repeat such rubbish as it was the biggest load of tosh and makes me furious to think people think up such far fetched stories.


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 11 Sep 07, 1:49 
Offline
Big Brother
User avatar
 WWW  Profile

Joined: 16 Apr 02, 22:31
Posts: 4353
Location: Lancashire & Malaysia
I have to confess I've had some serious doubts about the case from the very beginning.

If I were to discuss them it would seem I was pointing the finger at the parents... a foolish conclusion I admit because none of us really know the truth at the moment. However, the doubts persist and as more details come to light they merely reinforce my initial suspicions rather than settle them.

Certainly, I fear we're now past the point where a positive outcome is possible... for either the parents or missing child.


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 11 Sep 07, 8:06 
Offline
News Team Member
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 30 Dec 02, 18:50
Posts: 63927
Location: London

She's lost a daughter ..now police dossier asks prosecutors to charge her with ACCIDENTAL HOMICIDE

Police will today hand a dossier of evidence to prosecutors calling for Kate McCann to be charged with accidental homicide of her daughter.

Portuguese officers believe Kate, 39, mistakenly killed Madeleine the night the four-year-old vanished from their holiday flat 131 days ago. If convicted, the GP faces up to five years in jail. Detectives also suspect husband Gerry, 39, helped cover up the death by disposing of the body.

Forensic tests on samples found in the McCanns' hire car and apartment apparently support suspicions. The case files will be given to a prosecutor this morning.

Portuguese police chief Olegario Sousa said yesterday: "He will analyse it then make his decision."

Kate and Gerry, now home in Rothley, Leics, have been made formal suspects. They deny involvement in Madeleine's disappearance.

Mirror


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 11 Sep 07, 8:16 
Offline
News Team Member
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 30 Dec 02, 18:50
Posts: 63927
Location: London
McCann radio debate slammed
Listeners outraged by a BBC Radio Five Live debate on Madeleine McCann forced the station to change a phone-vote on her disappearance.

Victoria Derbyshire's morning phone-in today asked listeners to vote on whether they still had sympathy for Madeleine's parents Gerry and Kate after they were officially made suspects in the case by Portuguese police on Friday.

Dozens of listeners contacted the programme to say they did not think it was a suitable subject for debate while the legal process was still ongoing.

And the BBC head of TV news, Peter Horrocks, who was interviewed by Derbyshire, also appeared to question the station's coverage of the McCann story.

The weight of the negative reaction was such that producers were forced to change the vote to whether the station should be discussing the case at all - and listeners voted by 68% to 32% that it should not be.

One respondent told Derbyshire: "This is the ultimate in bad taste journalism which is ruining your programme today." Another demanded: "Take this programme off air."

A further caller said: "There is a criminal case which people are discussing the rights and wrongs of. If this was your daughter would you like the BBC to be discussing it?"

One caller called Malcolm asked for the debate to be stopped. "It is unusual for a lot of people to say to the BBC you have made a mistake on this topic," he said.

"This is not an appropriate topic for public debate. It is not right for our national broadcasting organisation to debate it."

When Derbyshire asked if he would rather the station did not debate the issue at all, he replied: "Yes. This is an on-going criminal case. It is a very simplistic question to ask people if they support the McCanns or not. It is like asking people if they are guilty or innocent."

Derbyshire admitted: "Lots of people are saying no, stop it right now."

She later told listeners: "We began the discussion this morning by asking if you supported the McCanns. Because of the number of text messages that were coming in saying you should not be discussing this, this is gutter journalism, I am switching off now, I then asked you, OK, should we be discussing this at all?"

Mr Horrocks, being interviewed about the media coverage of the case by Derbyshire, also appeared to question Five Live's judgment on its coverage of the case, particularly because his TV news department had decided not to go so big on the McCann story.

"This morning we have decided that it is not the most important story today, unlike this network which has been leading on this story," said Mr Horrocks, who has responsibility for New 24 as well as the BBC's TV news bulletins.

"Different parts of the BBC take different decisions but we decided to lead on the prime minister and the TUC conference this morning."

He later added: "I am not sure that some of the debate you have been having which is encouraging people to speculate and give their views one way or another is something we would do in TV news coverage."

Mr Horrocks also defended News 24's coverage of the case over the weekend. "There has been a lot of criticism but there has been a large number of people turning to BBC TV because they are keen to get new information about the story," he said.

He added that viewing for news bulletins was "one or two million up" on normal ratings, while stories on the BBC news website about Madeleine "were four or five times" more popular than others, something which he described as "unprecedented".
guardian


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 11 Sep 07, 10:08 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 04 Jun 02, 19:40
Posts: 29944
Location: Middle England
Police play down Madeleine DNA reports

Portuguese police have played down reports that a sample taken from the boot of the hire car used by Madeleine McCann's parents is a "99 per cent match" for the missing girl's DNA.

Ireland.com


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 11 Sep 07, 10:12 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 04 Jun 02, 19:40
Posts: 29944
Location: Middle England
Kate McCann, a victim of our emotional tyranny

Through dignity and self-preserving detachment she has denied the mob its vicarious pleasure

Everyone has a view on the disappearance of Madeleine McCann – but only the media have the power to inflict on us a tsunami of prejudice masquerading as detection.

BelfastTelegraph


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 11 Sep 07, 11:25 
Offline
Dancing Queen
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 22 Jun 02, 21:01
Posts: 11505
Location: Back at the wacky races
I heard on the news just now that there is no DNA evidence in the car, which begs the question, why has this been reported so much, as it seems to be the main evidence against the parents? Smacks of corruption to me, probably within the Police force. I think they need an independent police force to review all the evidence and details of the case so far, so that all this hysteria can be stopped.

_________________
Give me the gratuitous sax and the senseless violins.


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 11 Sep 07, 14:28 
Offline
Big Brother
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 07 Nov 01, 2:00
Posts: 10186
Yes, I suppose we can't really comment, because we don't know the true facts. We hear different things from different sources. Newspapers are renowned for twisting stories how they want, so we don't really know what is and what isn't fact.

Unfortunately, the McCanns request that the British police get involved, has been turned down (well, according to the paper that is!). :-?

Quote:
Detectives also suspect husband Gerry, 39, helped cover up the death by disposing of the body.


Surely if that was the case, then the dogs would have smelt a corpse on him also, but it has only been reported that they smelt it on Mrs McCanns jeans.


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 11 Sep 07, 19:18 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar
 WWW  Profile

Joined: 29 Jun 02, 16:52
Posts: 10718
The main thing about all this that bugs me personally is that she washed the cuddly toy. I don't care if it had become dirty, as a mother I'm certain I wouldn't wash it.

_________________
I only want an iPodShuffle, I'm not greedy


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 11 Sep 07, 20:30 
Offline
Big Brother
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 07 Nov 01, 2:00
Posts: 10186
There was also another report which said that there was a speck of blood on the floor in the apartment, which was very minute and difficult to read because the floor had been scrubbed in that spot so many times, which raises the question of why was the floor scrubbed in that place so much?

However, it is hard to know how true these reports are. I have only read that in one report I think.

If she had kept a dead body there in hot temperatures, wouldn't it have smelt or was there a freezer there which it could be kept in? How would you keep it out of the reach of 2 inquisitive toddlers?


Top
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 12 Sep 07, 0:19 
Offline
Motor Nutcase
User avatar
 Profile

Joined: 12 Feb 04, 20:17
Posts: 15119
I don't want to hear any more about it until there's some kind of concrete conclusion. I hate spin of any kind and I'm hating the tit-for-tat carry on that seems to be happening between the Portuguese authorities and other people.


Top
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 1392 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 ... 93  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group. All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective owners. Material breaching copyright laws should be reported to webmaster (-at-) bbfans.com. BBFans.com is in no way affilated with Channel4 or Endemol.